Best Bang for the Buck Comparison Spreadsheet

[anticon]

I went back to some of my old spreadsheets when I was trying to pick a car (I'm an engineer, spreadsheets are one of my favorite tools). I thought it was kind of interesting to see the best "bang for your buck" in terms of Power To Weight Ratio/MSRP. At the time the Fiesta ST ranked near the top for anything under $25k. I think with some mods it pushes it much higher. But it's got me wondering what if the other cars on the list were modded, how much do those mods cost and what are the overall performance gains. I put a spreadsheet on Google Sheets below to see if I can get some help figuring this out, if anyone wants to help determine how a modded Fiesta ST stacks up against a modded version of its competitors. I would be very interested in seeing the results. I think it will either take direct experience or some deep research/assumptions to figure out pricing and performance gains for mods of other cars, which is why I am leaving it as a public sheet. I get the feeling there are a lot of performance gains to be had on the 1.6T engine for a good value i.e. S280 or Whoosh Hybrid compared to other platforms but I really have no clue as this is my first performance car. Obviously, there are more things to account for than just power to weight ratio (e.g. handling) but that's a pretty good one to start with. I suppose gas mileage could be one but really I don't care about MPG. One thing is I feel like the Fiesta should get knocked down a little for not having an LSD from the factory. I based my initial info on a couple references, linked below.

The modded Fiesta ST is based on a budget version of my eventual build, Recaros, Whoosh hybrid on E30, plugs, with LSD, tires and wheels, a roll restrictor.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1x-25-7UQg_WtW_xyc7mwE6RUdxTZTBwieOtiFQOaQCc/edit?usp=sharing


References:
https://www.autoblog.com/2014/07/02/best-car-power-to-weight-ratios-feature/
https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/22fre7 View: https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/22fre7/i_made_a_power_to_weight_ratio_spreadsheet_of_a/

 

[Snrub]

I don't know... I don't honestly think the FiST's big selling point is it's power to weight ratio. I don't think it's necessarily outright performance either. Any car can be modified, unless there's something different about a car which makes it receptive to modifications, I don't think that counts as a selling point either. I really think what makes the FiST good is FUN; quick turn in, good sensation of speed, lighter weight, nice mix of attributes. It's not a numbers car, it's about fun

Take a look at Car and Driver's lightning lap historical results. https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a23319884/lightning-lap-times-historical-data/
The FiST is 7 seconds a lap slower than the 2008 Cobalt SS. There was a cheap factory tune which gave that car 290hp/320ftlbs. It weighed 200lbs more. If you want to talk modification, the engine has a higher peak power potential.

Or look at the 6th gen Camaro V6 1LE. It's $10k+ more expensive, but it's 16+ seconds faster. No amount of power you can add to the FiST will close that gap. You can get to the same performance level with a base V6 plus some suspension bits and tires for say mid-high $20ks (new). My previous car was a 6th Gen Camaro SS, which is the same car with 40% more power, they start $15k more expensive. In no typical performance metric can the FiST compete to either car. From a modification perspective, you're going to be hard pressed to get a FiST into the Camaro SS performance level for any amount of money spent. The Camaro is sold with a 650hp variant with DSSV shocks and humiliates exotica worth multiples of it's price, so all varients have greater modification potential. ...But the FiST is more fun than the V6/SS Camaro in street driving.

I had an RX-8 before that. It's not a numbers car either, but there is a better chassis/suspension grace than the FiST. It's fun in a different way. The 86/BRZ and ND Miata/Fiat 124 are also not numbers car and a lot of FUN.

 

[anticon]

I don't know... I don't honestly think the FiST's big selling point is it's power to weight ratio. I don't think it's necessarily outright performance either. Any car can be modified, unless there's something different about a car which makes it receptive to modifications, I don't think that counts as a selling point either. I really think what makes the FiST good is FUN; quick turn in, good sensation of speed, lighter weight, nice mix of attributes. It's not a numbers car, it's about fun

Take a look at Car and Driver's lightning lap historical results. https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a23319884/lightning-lap-times-historical-data/
The FiST is 7 seconds a lap slower than the 2008 Cobalt SS. There was a cheap factory tune which gave that car 290hp/320ftlbs. It weighed 200lbs more. If you want to talk modification, the engine has a higher peak power potential.

Or look at the 6th gen Camaro V6 1LE. It's $10k+ more expensive, but it's 16+ seconds faster. No amount of power you can add to the FiST will close that gap. You can get to the same performance level with a base V6 plus some suspension bits and tires for say mid-high $20ks (new). My previous car was a 6th Gen Camaro SS, which is the same car with 40% more power, they start $15k more expensive. In no typical performance metric can the FiST compete to either car. From a modification perspective, you're going to be hard pressed to get a FiST into the Camaro SS performance level for any amount of money spent. The Camaro is sold with a 650hp variant with DSSV shocks and humiliates exotica worth multiples of it's price, so all varients have greater modification potential. ...But the FiST is more fun than the V6/SS Camaro in street driving.

I had an RX-8 before that. It's not a numbers car either, but there is a better chassis/suspension grace than the FiST. It's fun in a different way. The 86/BRZ and ND Miata/Fiat 124 are also not numbers car and a lot of FUN.

Thank you. This is the exact kind of feedback I was hoping for.

 

[kivnul]

I've always been a fan of the power/weight/weight as it gives bonus to more nimble cars.

 

[DoomsdayMelody]

I went back to some of my old spreadsheets when I was trying to pick a car (I'm an engineer, spreadsheets are one of my favorite tools). I thought it was kind of interesting to see the best "bang for your buck" in terms of Power To Weight Ratio/MSRP. At the time the Fiesta ST ranked near the top for anything under $25k. I think with some mods it pushes it much higher. But it's got me wondering what if the other cars on the list were modded, how much do those mods cost and what are the overall performance gains. I put a spreadsheet on Google Sheets below to see if I can get some help figuring this out, if anyone wants to help determine how a modded Fiesta ST stacks up against a modded version of its competitors. I would be very interested in seeing the results. I think it will either take direct experience or some deep research/assumptions to figure out pricing and performance gains for mods of other cars, which is why I am leaving it as a public sheet. I get the feeling there are a lot of performance gains to be had on the 1.6T engine for a good value i.e. S280 or Whoosh Hybrid compared to other platforms but I really have no clue as this is my first performance car. Obviously, there are more things to account for than just power to weight ratio (e.g. handling) but that's a pretty good one to start with. I suppose gas mileage could be one but really I don't care about MPG. One thing is I feel like the Fiesta should get knocked down a little for not having an LSD from the factory. I based my initial info on a couple references, linked below.

The modded Fiesta ST is based on a budget version of my eventual build, Recaros, Whoosh hybrid on E30, plugs, with LSD, tires and wheels, a roll restrictor.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1x-25-7UQg_WtW_xyc7mwE6RUdxTZTBwieOtiFQOaQCc/edit?usp=sharing


References:
https://www.autoblog.com/2014/07/02/best-car-power-to-weight-ratios-feature/
https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/22fre7 View: https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/22fre7/i_made_a_power_to_weight_ratio_spreadsheet_of_a/

Disclaimer: I love the FiST, I bought one, but there’s gonna be some pointed observations here.

While the Fiesta ST is a bargain on the used market, dollar per performance I don’t think it necessarily comes to the top of the list on the used market, especially if fuel economy isn’t a concern. In Ford’s own stable, you can find 2014 and earlier Mustang GTs, for low 20s on down. To get the fiesta engine up to the 400+ HP mark to be competitive with the 5.0, you could spend a similar amount of money on tires and suspension on the mustang and end up with a better package that will likely more reliable from the perspective of the powertrain.

But, even outside of used Fords, there’s quite a few options. Saturn Sky redlines, with GM’s then new 2.0 turbo ecotec 4 cylinder can be found for roughly the same price as a well used fiesta ST right now. C5/6 corvettes also exist in this price range, and while probably won’t have an easy time buying a stick, they do occasionally pop up. E46 M3s are down in roughly the same price range, and the boxster and cayman also exist in the $10-$20k range. Not to mention, of course, things like the FRS/BRZ/86 or the mx-5.

I guess what I’m getting at, since the FiST only exists on the used market, is that there’s quite a few driving machines that I would absolutely consider in lieu of a FiST, particularly if fuel economy wasn’t a concern. But the FiST does really stand out if you want something that is fun, feels powerful, and delivers solid fuel economy. I do wish it came with an LSD from the factory though, even “just” a torsen would’ve been phenomenal.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[anticon]

Disclaimer: I love the FiST, I bought one, but there’s gonna be some pointed observations here.

While the Fiesta ST is a bargain on the used market, dollar per performance I don’t think it necessarily comes to the top of the list on the used market, especially if fuel economy isn’t a concern. In Ford’s own stable, you can find 2014 and earlier Mustang GTs, for low 20s on down. To get the fiesta engine up to the 400+ HP mark to be competitive with the 5.0, you could spend a similar amount of money on tires and suspension on the mustang and end up with a better package that will likely more reliable from the perspective of the powertrain.

But, even outside of used Fords, there’s quite a few options. Saturn Sky redlines, with GM’s then new 2.0 turbo ecotec 4 cylinder can be found for roughly the same price as a well used fiesta ST right now. C5/6 corvettes also exist in this price range, and while probably won’t have an easy time buying a stick, they do occasionally pop up. E46 M3s are down in roughly the same price range, and the boxster and cayman also exist in the $10-$20k range. Not to mention, of course, things like the FRS/BRZ/86 or the mx-5.

I guess what I’m getting at, since the FiST only exists on the used market, is that there’s quite a few driving machines that I would absolutely consider in lieu of a FiST, particularly if fuel economy wasn’t a concern. But the FiST does really stand out if you want something that is fun, feels powerful, and delivers solid fuel economy. I do wish it came with an LSD from the factory though, even “just” a torsen would’ve been phenomenal.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I do keep my eye out for MR2s and Boxters. I would love a first gen MR2. Not that they would perform the same, it just sounds like fun to have a mid engine with pop up headlights. Here is GT for 6k. That would be hard to beat.https://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/cto/d/portland-2005-mustang-gt/7338310929.html

 

[Dpro]

I am gonna come right out and say I have owned and driven a lot of sports cars. There are few that drive like a FiST. Its not just a power to weight ratio thing because 200hp stock in a 2750lb is really not that much for a modern day car. A early 240z was a 2350 lb car that had 150 hp and that was 1970.

The FiST falls into the same category in the power to weight ratio game as a MX5 aka Miata or the FRS/BRZ/GT86 . These are all slower cars that are extremely agile and fun to drive and that is the slow car feels fast.

I would never compare it any Mustang or bigger sports GT car as they are just all together different and will not give the same driving experience.

A Boxster is a different experience as well closer to the is category would be a MR2 or a Lotus Elise. Thing is I had and drove a 2gen MR2 ., Do they handle great yes are there devilish sides to the car oh yes. The MR is no where near as forgiving.

The Lotus Elise is really a car unto itself categorically its truly a Go Kart and it truly sacrifices certain things to go there. None of these cars really are comparable to the FiST beyond the fact that the FiST can actually hold its own against in the corners.

Thats the thing thats amazing about the FiST the econobox grocery getter that does not drive like an econobox grocery getter.
Therefor does it really make sense to try and make a spreadsheet comparing it other sports cars power to weight ratio .

Does it make sense to by a car for 15-20k and drop another 8-9k in it to make as fast a Caymen in the power to weight ratio.
I know I did and quite honestly for under 30k I have a car that is a complete sleeper. Yet it performs as well and keeps up with cars costing closer to 50k. Is it a bargain even with mods yes.
Though the thing that sold me on the FiST having driven a lot more expensive cars is the fact that it was/is so much fun.
Few cars deliver that fun factor and that is really where the comparison should be bang for the buck fun factor.

Power to weight? Ya I could compare the power to weight considering I am about to hit 300whp in a 2750Lb car but that does not mean anything if its not fun to drive.

A lot of those cars with more or equal still are not as fun to drive. Its not only power to weight. Its also about handling characteristics but in the end?
Which car is the most fun to drive?

 

[ronmcdon]

Or look at the 6th gen Camaro V6 1LE. It's $10k+ more expensive, but it's 16+ seconds faster. No amount of power you can add to the FiST will close that gap. You can get to the same performance level with a base V6 plus some suspension bits and tires for say mid-high $20ks (new). My previous car was a 6th Gen Camaro SS, which is the same car with 40% more power, they start $15k more expensive. In no typical performance metric can the FiST compete to either car. From a modification perspective, you're going to be hard pressed to get a FiST into the Camaro SS performance level for any amount of money spent. The Camaro is sold with a 650hp variant with DSSV shocks and humiliates exotica worth multiples of it's price, so all varients have greater modification potential. ...But the FiST is more fun than the V6/SS Camaro in street driving.

I had an RX-8 before that. It's not a numbers car either, but there is a better chassis/suspension grace than the FiST. It's fun in a different way. The 86/BRZ and ND Miata/Fiat 124 are also not numbers car and a lot of FUN.

I'm with you on the fiesta being more fun to drive on the street, arguably a better autoX than the 6th gen camaro. maybe better canyon car would be my guess. there's a huge difference in wheelbase and weight. Have a 6th gen camaro myself. between the size, visibility, ultra harsh non-adjustable dssv shocks and not being used to cars that large took me time to adjust driving it, camaro sometimes pita on the streets. Where as with the fiesta, it's fun from the get go.

consumables are also a high point for the fiesta if you do any track driving. for my fiesta, my last set of more expensive 225/45/16 z3 tires were under 800 (well worth it over the 205s). 205/50/16 z3's under 600. just got a set of 200tw supercar 3's this weekend for my camero at almost 1,700 (325 & 305 /19's). Oh MPG matters a lot! Can't beat around 2 gallons of gas for a 20 min session. If you just want to do a lot of track time affordably, daily drive something fun & practical, have a very easy to rotate fwd car, it's a solid choice. doing more track days this year than ever in my life bc the consumables are so affordable.

 

[Smikike]

Powerful, you mean overall muscle strength or an excellent car overall? Well, my goes to the Suzuki Escudo Pikes Peak version, because it's a wicked car.
https://cararac.com/blog/100-most-powerful-cars.html

 

[Dpro]

Powerful, you mean overall muscle strength or an excellent car overall? Well, my goes to the Suzuki Escudo Pikes Peak version, because it's a wicked car.

We are talking cars that one can buy not full out competition cars.