Michelin Pilot Super Sport 205/45ZR17/XL

[ronmcdon]

Upped tire pressure to 45PSI in the fronts and 43PSI on the rears. Feels a bit better but marginally. The DNA racing arms are what might have to be next after coils.

what are you hoping to get out of the DNA arms?
been thinking of them myself but not sure if the cost would be worthwhile.

 

[Magnetic]

what are you hoping to get out of the DNA arms?
been thinking of them myself but not sure if the cost would be worthwhile.

2 things:

New bushings since the car is @77K miles
More responsive steering

 

[Dpro]

2 things:

New bushings since the car is @77K miles
More responsive steering

Weill I can say having driven Ron’s car that he achieved both those things without buying the DNA arms. I would say one should not buy the DNA arms unless they are serious tracking competively. Even then there are people here who have just bushings on their factory arms and done well in autocross and track events.

 

[ronmcdon]

that makes total sense.

would recommend swapping out the existing front lca bushings with poly powerflex bushings. did that and felt the car being a lot more responsive. Its also not an a pricey option, esp if you can do your own labor. the spherical / aluminum Alex the Mechanic steering bushing is great too and something I wish was mentioned here more often. I also wonder if going with upgraded passenger and tranny months make a difference (did all 3 at same time so can't say).

I think DNA has 2 models of the control arms. Maybe Ron at Whoosh can help out but there hasn't been a lot of feedback with the DNA control arms. One of the pricier of the two models seem to have spherical bushings. Unless this is a more a dedicated track car, would be mindful of possible increase in ride quality if that matters to you. With suspension tuning, ideally, imo you want to do 1 thing at a time. But if does what its supposed to and set up well and you don't mind the ride quality, would say it's hard to go wrong. Do let us know what you think if you go that route.

 

[ronmcdon]

Weill I can say having driven Ron’s car that he achieved both those things without buying the DNA arms. I would say one should not buy the DNA arms unless they are serious tracking competively. Even then there are people here who have just bushings on their factory arms and done well in autocross and track events.

thank you thank you! Good to get feedback as a reference point. I wonder also if the lsd had anything to do with response.

I'm with DPRO that front negative camber makes a good difference. -2 front is not really that bad tire wear wise at all if you're a more spirited driver. -1 would or less would be terrible if doing any autoX or hpde. Even -2 is not quite enough and got me too much outside tire wear. I run -3 front, -1 rear and it's really nice response wise. Yes there might be a bit more wear, but its up to you to decide if the compromise is worth it. Personally I think it is, especially considering how affordable our tires are.

45psi front, 43 rear tire pressure (assuming cold) is pretty high. Would wonder if you are loosing some grip if not response bc of that. On the street I like 32ish front 35 rear cold. 660s are pretty much one of the most responsive street tires I've had. Even the z3's cant quite measure up.

 

[Dpro]

thank you thank you! Good to get feedback as a reference point. I wonder also if the lsd had anything to do with response.

I'm with DPRO that front negative camber makes a good difference. -2 front is not really that bad tire wear wise at all if you're a more spirited driver. -1 would or less would be terrible if doing any autoX or hpde. Even -2 is not quite enough and got me too much outside tire wear. I run -3 front, -1 rear and it's really nice response wise. Yes there might be a bit more wear, but its up to you to decide if the compromise is worth it. Personally I think it is, especially considering how affordable our tires are.

45psi front, 43 rear tire pressure (assuming cold) is pretty high. Would wonder if you are loosing some grip if not response bc of that. On the street I like 32ish front 35 rear cold. 660s are pretty much one of the most responsive street tires I've had. Even the z3's cant quite measure up.

I am sure the Diff helped. Mine is on order. I can’t wait for it. I am also planning on dialing in more negative camber up front. The control arm bushings are looming on the horizon as well. I think its all the little things I am ironing out now expensse wise. The diff is like the last major expense on my car.

 

[Magnetic]

I'm trying to use negative camber as a last resort or as the last dialing in for the car.

These are the steps I have lined up for suspension/chassis in order:

1. Coils (anyday now just waiting for them to get processed)
2. DNA control arms
3. Eibach front and rear sway bars.
4. Rear chassis tunnel bracing. (Already have the pierce 6 point)

After that maybe some camber for the outer wear which is a great point. I hate it when the tires roll and eat the edges off so I'm open to some camber there now that I think about it.

 

[Dpro]

I'm trying to use negative camber as a last resort or as the last dialing in for the car.

These are the steps I have lined up for suspension/chassis in order:

1. Coils (anyday now just waiting for them to get processed)
2. DNA control arms
3. Eibach front and rear sway bars.
4. Rear chassis tunnel bracing. (Already have the pierce 6 point)

After that maybe some camber for the outer wear which is a great point. I hate it when the tires roll and eat the edges off so I'm open to some camber there now that I think about it.

I am not sure what this aversion to negative camber is. You really should read some books on handling and corning and suspension.

Putting on the control arms is overkill unless you are seriously tracking the car. Same for the front swaybar. Our cars do not need it. It barely needs a rear swaybar. Unless you start adding negative camber back there.

Coils well we all tend to do it because ride height adjustability. Bracing is a yin yang thing some people swear by it.

Fact is our chassis is pretty stiff to begin with and does not need as much as a lot of people do.

Fact is negative camber to improve cornering grip is one of the oldest tricks in the book and is not something trendy or stance boi thing.
We were putting negative camber on our front wheels back in the day on 510’s when I was in high school before the idea of stance had even been thought of.
.

 

[ronmcdon]

I would say if cautious of camber, go conservative with -2 front, -1 rear (maybe -.8 more realistic for our cars) or even -1.5 front.

When I bring my car to one of the better suspension tuners in CA, West End Alignment (RIP) they would typically ask what I want my alignment to be, relative to what I use my car for (more daily or driving events) and what I want my tire wear to be. A more conservative alignment typically is closer to -2 front -1 rear.

I also have my mother's daily driver '16 civic at -2 front, -1 rear, Civic Si or type R (I forget) rear bar, front upper strut bar, firestone firehawk 500 tires (dont recommend for responsiveness) and it's notably more responsive than stock and tire wear has not been inconsistent.

alignment is pretty effective and inexpensive as far as tweaks one can do to their car. bc I am a bit anal with that, I get it done after every 2-3 track days. Its like $80 for front alignment so not too bad.

personal suggestion, when getting a new car also recommend one of the first things to do is get an alignment. lot of cars from the factory don't get it right, it just may not be so bad it's noticeable. however after getting a good alignment it can feel noticeably more responsive.

 

[Magnetic]

K-Sport Coilovers installed today. Def feels a MILLION times better than stock. Somehow it also feels like it has a much better ride quality. Ended up adding 2 degrees of camber and it actually feels really nice. Doesn't look too bad either. Hardly noticeable.

 

[Dpro]

K-Sport Coilovers installed today. Def feels a MILLION times better than stock. Somehow it also feels like it has a much better ride quality. Ended up adding 2 degrees of camber and it actually feels really nice. Doesn't look too bad either. Hardly noticeable.

I told you so.